Original ILM Studio Scale X-Wings-How many? (Archive please)

One of my questions in this thread was, "What about Red 4?"

In reviewing old threads in the Studio Scale Forum, it was mentioned that on Page 42 of the first Industrial Light & Magic book (by Thomas G Smith), Lucas is standing near a Red 4 model. Same pic is also in the LFL Archives book, preface page VIII.

Sure enough--he is...

Any more insight to this?

Any more shots of this model?

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PaulF2000 wrote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
You know guys I really don't care to argue over something that's not even mine

Paul
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And yet you keep posting......

Just reviewed the credits of ANH...

Red 4 was credited, as was Red 6 (Porkins)...

So...

What did Red 4 and Red 6 look like?

Here is a picture of Red 4-or whats left of him...This wing is in Bob Burn's basement.

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Chaucer44 wrote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
They looked ALOT like this:


Yours,
Cris
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HA HA HA!! VERY FUNNY!! (Actually, it was!)

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Rocketbobs wrote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
Here is a picture of Red 4-or whats left of him...This wing is in Bob Burn's basement.

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THAT is very cool!

"In reviewing old threads in the Studio Scale Forum, it was mentioned that on Page 42 of the first Industrial Light & Magic book (by Thomas G Smith), Lucas is standing near a Red 4 model".

Indeed. It's my belief that the "Red Four" model seen in the picture:



is in fact the original Red Five model from STAR WARS:



With the exception of the miniatures which appear only very briefly before being blown up (and John Knoll's CGI hybrids, which - in my book at least - don't really count), you've already listed all of the models which actually appear on screen in STAR WARS.

I lean towards agreeing, MR... THe weathering on both those birds lok a LOT alike...

What sacle is that one? Next to Big G, it loks BIGGER than 1/24...

Do you suppose there are no surviving Red 6 models as it was a pyro only perhaps?

It's the same size as the other STAR WARS X-Wings that you've seen. It's not really next to Mr Lucas, it's on a desk in front of him. The picture was taken with quite a wide angle lens, which exagerates the perspective somewhat. Whether or not it's 1/24 is a matter for debate. Chronicles says the models were 1/16. The pilots were cast from 1/24 figures, but the astromech droids aren't 1/24th of the size of the full size Artoos. Personally, since there aren't any real X-Wings, and the full size mockup(s) weren't exactly the same as the miniatures, I don't think that assigning an exact figure to the scale really matters.

The hero/pyro dichotomy is a bit too simple, I think. Chronicles (which can't be trusted) tells us that nine models were constructed for explosions, and five models were lighted. As you probably already know, the concensus is that the left/right fuselage "kits" were created because the top/bottom fuselage models didn't explode in a satisfactory manner. Presumably, they must have blown up at least one top/bottom model to determine this. Does that account for one or more of the nine, or were there nine "pyro kit" models, five lighted models plus extra top/bottom pyro models, or are Chronicles's figures completely wrong? Additionally, some of the models which we see blown up in STAR WARS are very simple constructions, unlike the "pyro kit" models which seem more or less identical to the "hero" models.

ILM built at least one model with six wing stripes and at least one model with four wing stripes; you can see them in the picture at the bottom of page 111 of Chronicles. This picture also shows two Red One models, and a Red Three model which doesn't appear to be the same as the one in Art of Star Wars.

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Miniaturizer Ray wrote:<HR></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS=$row_color>
It's the same size as the other STAR WARS X-Wings that you've seen. It's not really next to Mr Lucas, it's on a desk in front of him. The picture was taken with quite a wide angle lens, which exagerates the perspective somewhat.
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Makes sense...

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Whether or not it's 1/24 is a matter for debate. Chronicles says the models were 1/16. The pilots were cast from 1/24 figures, but the astromech droids aren't 1/24th of the size of the full size Artoos. Personally, since there aren't any real X-Wings, and the full size mockup(s) weren't exactly the same as the miniatures, I don't think that assigning an exact figure to the scale really matters.
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Agreed, particlularly since it is in fact a fictional ship. I refer to 1/24 as the commonly-accepted size of the Icons/CC "Studio Scale". Very interesting discussion, nonetheless, on the derivation of scale of these models!

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The hero/pyro dichotomy is a bit too simple, I think. Chronicles (which can't be trusted) tells us that nine models were constructed for explosions, and five models were lighted. As you probably already know, the concensus is that the left/right fuselage "kits" were created because the top/bottom fuselage models didn't explode in a satisfactory manner. Presumably, they must have blown up at least one top/bottom model to determine this. Does that account for one or more of the nine, or were there nine "pyro kit" models, five lighted models plus extra top/bottom pyro models, or are Chronicles's figures completely wrong? Additionally, some of the models which we see blown up in STAR WARS are very simple constructions, unlike the "pyro kit" models which seem more or less identical to the "hero" models.
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A couple very intriguing (albeit not very "telling") shots come from my first and favorite behind-the-scenes publication, "The Star Wars Album", published by Ballantine Books way back in November, 1977. One shot shows the parts of a side-to-side fuselage kit... Another shot shows no less than 7 X's lined on a table with who appears to be Grant McCune standing near the table. Not "telling", however, in that there is no visual reference to the type of models they are (Pyro versus Hero), and no visible wing pips/stripes.

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ILM built at least one model with six wing stripes and at least one model with four wing stripes; you can see them in the picture at the bottom of page 111 of Chronicles.
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Due to the sheer size of that damn book, it is buried right now, and I'm too tired to dig it out!

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...and a Red Three model which doesn't appear to be the same as the one in Art of Star Wars.
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Yes! Along those same lines, what is the deal with the larger scale X in the MoM tour? Looks very much like Luke's, but has three wing pips (stripes?), and does NOT maintain the same weathering/coloring scheme as the "traditiomnal" Red 3...!

The picture I'm talking about shows the same seven models as the picture you're talking about (I have that one somewhere, too. On the Behind the Magic CD, maybe?). The front one is Red Three, but it's weathered very differently from the Art of Star Wars picture. The large model seems to have been constructed for use in RETURN OF THE JEDI, although I don't know if it actually appears in the movie. Maybe it was built for the unused sandstorm sequence at the beginning? This model does show up in the Special Edition of STAR WARS : Some of the panels on the sides are used in the photomontage textures on the CGI X-Wings.

One last tidbit that I've come across: There is, apparently, a Japanese edition of Starlog magazine that has some pictures of X-Wing models, including a Red Six model which has a yellow canopy. This is just something that I've read about, mind, not seen for myself, so I don't know whether these were actually original STAR WARS miniatures or not.

I let this thread slide for a couple of weeks...

Thanks again Ray for the insight...

Any more history/info/insight on the ole' X-Wing before this thread slides into oblivion...?

Or is it worth archiving?

Mods, can we acrchive this?

I asked over two weeks ago to have this archived... Can we, please?


2/12/02: Request 3

Can't they just drop this into Studio Scale? I'd like to keep this around also and add more in the upcoming week.

Dave

archived

Yes there was. Here it is.

Wow, thanks for posting those. This blows the hell out of any Red 4 reference I had.

Also, Holy Zombie Thread, Batman!

Thank you for this great reference photos. Much appreciated.