Voltaire Surge
Member
Ahh ok. So momentary push buttons would be the best choice for the light up buttons? How do u have the mk iv power button set up?
@Voltaire Surge, It really depends on how your wiring things and if you have a controller. I explained the buttons in this design just in the last paragraph.
--------------------------
Okay, I finally output some new images showing all the new progress!
(This doesn't mean I am going whole hog, just got caught up in the Fallout 76 hype)
-------------------------
First off a new general image. You may not notice much new here, aside from the new game-accurate Power and LIght button sizes.
-------------------------
This image shows all the 3D printed parts faded. As you can see there is a lot inside.
The model consists of 46 sub-assemblies.
There are currently 149 unique parts, and 383 components total. (Not yet including most of the electronic components)
Let just say I have those "Ultimate Collectible" models beat.
-------------------------
Inside the front you can see the new PCBs, as well as all the wires. Yes, I even 3D model the wiring.
-------------------------
After way too many different attempts to stick in other batteries, such as camera batteries, I realized that a rectangular battery doesn't work inside a round enclosure.
So I managed to find just enough space in the rear half of the Pip-Boy for four AAA batteries. They would be 800mAh NiMh each, outputting 5 to 6V. The plan is to recharge them via USB or external power.
-------------------------
These animations show the updated holotape mechanism. By adding a half-gear, I was able to link one of the lifting arms to a Rotary Speed Limiter. These devices use two plates separated by some oil to create a dampening effect on the gear. These are used commonly to make soft open drawers and hinges. It should work to recreate the slow-opening effect that is seen in-game. It took a while to find these as a commercial product, but alas McMaster-Carr seems to have everything.
-------------------------
The gearing on the radio knob was increased to 9:1 by stacking thinner gears together. Not only does this make it feel more like a real radio, it also allows for much finer tuning. Prototyping will show if there is too much backlash in the gears.
I am very proud of how these stacked gears work to move still keeping the knob concentric to the needle.
-------------------------
Here you can see the relocated select wheel detent mechanism. It will be housed inside the cover at the back of the Pip-Boy. When something like this works out, I know that the original Pip-Boy artistic designer really new his stuff when it came to mechanics.
You can also see the large button travel for the select button.
-------------------------
And just for that extra mechanical engineering porn, here is the rad needle animated. Making this work may be one of the more complex software tasks I need to learn. The tiny gauge motor uses two opposing coils to move the needle. It will require some intense math (at least for me) to set the exact position.
--------------------------
Okay, I finally output some new images showing all the new progress!
(This doesn't mean I am going whole hog, just got caught up in the Fallout 76 hype)
-------------------------
First off a new general image. You may not notice much new here, aside from the new game-accurate Power and LIght button sizes.
-------------------------
This image shows all the 3D printed parts faded. As you can see there is a lot inside.
The model consists of 46 sub-assemblies.
There are currently 149 unique parts, and 383 components total. (Not yet including most of the electronic components)
Let just say I have those "Ultimate Collectible" models beat.
-------------------------
Inside the front you can see the new PCBs, as well as all the wires. Yes, I even 3D model the wiring.
-------------------------
After way too many different attempts to stick in other batteries, such as camera batteries, I realized that a rectangular battery doesn't work inside a round enclosure.
So I managed to find just enough space in the rear half of the Pip-Boy for four AAA batteries. They would be 800mAh NiMh each, outputting 5 to 6V. The plan is to recharge them via USB or external power.
-------------------------
These animations show the updated holotape mechanism. By adding a half-gear, I was able to link one of the lifting arms to a Rotary Speed Limiter. These devices use two plates separated by some oil to create a dampening effect on the gear. These are used commonly to make soft open drawers and hinges. It should work to recreate the slow-opening effect that is seen in-game. It took a while to find these as a commercial product, but alas McMaster-Carr seems to have everything.
-------------------------
The gearing on the radio knob was increased to 9:1 by stacking thinner gears together. Not only does this make it feel more like a real radio, it also allows for much finer tuning. Prototyping will show if there is too much backlash in the gears.
I am very proud of how these stacked gears work to move still keeping the knob concentric to the needle.
-------------------------
Here you can see the relocated select wheel detent mechanism. It will be housed inside the cover at the back of the Pip-Boy. When something like this works out, I know that the original Pip-Boy artistic designer really new his stuff when it came to mechanics.
You can also see the large button travel for the select button.
-------------------------
And just for that extra mechanical engineering porn, here is the rad needle animated. Making this work may be one of the more complex software tasks I need to learn. The tiny gauge motor uses two opposing coils to move the needle. It will require some intense math (at least for me) to set the exact position.
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Voltaire Surge
Member
Oof. Man this is a thing of beauty. Before this i didnt think it would really take an engineer to design the pipboys, but i guess it really does. XD then again this is the most advanced design.
Voltaire Surge
Member
I was more asking what specific switch you are using for the front power button. Model and such.
@Voltaire Surge, The switch I plan on using is E-Switch P/N: TL1265YQSCLR. They are momentary switches with a amber LED and clear cover. The cover will be replaced by a more accurate clear resin 3D printed model.
-------------------
I figured out a way to make the soft-open feature a one-way device. This means you can press the eject button and the holotape is slowly lifted upwards. But upon inserting it you can slam the cassette mechanism closed.
This mechanism is similar to what is used on a bicycle clutch. The (blue) gear is driven by the ejecting holotape cassette caddy. As it opens it catches the (orange) prawl inside.
But upon closing, the long arms on the pawl can flex inwards and allow the blue gear to slip past. All the forces have to be just right. I should be able laser-cut these two parts, instead of 3D printing them. This makes tweaking their final dimensions much easier.
-------------------
I figured out a way to make the soft-open feature a one-way device. This means you can press the eject button and the holotape is slowly lifted upwards. But upon inserting it you can slam the cassette mechanism closed.
This mechanism is similar to what is used on a bicycle clutch. The (blue) gear is driven by the ejecting holotape cassette caddy. As it opens it catches the (orange) prawl inside.
But upon closing, the long arms on the pawl can flex inwards and allow the blue gear to slip past. All the forces have to be just right. I should be able laser-cut these two parts, instead of 3D printing them. This makes tweaking their final dimensions much easier.
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Voltaire Surge
Member
Thanks man. And dang thats pretty cool just how much you are putting in for the sake of game accuracy. Thats awesome. And also super complicated XD but very awesome. I cant wait to see it in the final prototyping stages and have your initial designs for it vs the final designs just to see how much was changed from the beginning and end.
so your going to build a real one of these? D: i cant say i envy you.... this is a HUGE task. Its amazing work youve done in the cad, its equally amazing you made everything work 
But damn putting this together for real is going to be a right nightmare
Good luck
But damn putting this together for real is going to be a right nightmare
Good luck
@MangyDog: Yes. As real as I can possibly make it. It has been a huge task. It will be very hard to put together, but I have lots of experience with such things. I have written assembly instructions in excess of 60 pages a few times, with assemblies that have more then two thousand total parts. However, those are typically static electro-mechanical things. The Pip-Boy has a lot of moving parts. For example....
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Lets see how complicated I can make the USB data cable. It was suggested that I could make the USB connector retract. In order to make the final look more authentic to the game. I thought it was someone in this thread, but I couldn't find the post. In either case at 3am this morning my home fire alarms went off for no apparent reason. So I was wide awake, trying to go back to sleep when my brain latched onto this idea.
So I started work on designing a retractable USB connector. The mechanism is not much different from what is inside a lipstick case. You have a pin that rides in a helical channel. The USB cable is fixed so it can't twist inside the black housing, but it is locked to the helical transport. (Shown in orange).
When you twist the white portion, the pin slides, and pulls the transport back into the housing. The harder challenge was actually making it so that the white and black parts mate in a way that they don't come apart when you do this twisting action. To that end I have a maze inside the black housing which you would have to do multiple twist/pull operations on the white portion before the two parts could be seperated. This seemed a better solution then some snap-fit. I am a huge proponent of serviceable products, and so I don't want any permanent connections, or things that break when you take them apart. This extends as far as using a set screw to hold the USB in place instead of say glue.
Yes, this is way overkill for the design. But like I have said earlier, once I get an idea my brain just sort of processes on it over time. Then it sort of pops back up when I realize the solution. I had the above soft-open idea written down months ago. Getting it into CAD frees up my thoughts, sort of like when you finally get rid of a song playing over and over.
(Also, it's five hours later, the house hasn't burned down yet)
-------------------
Lets see how complicated I can make the USB data cable. It was suggested that I could make the USB connector retract. In order to make the final look more authentic to the game. I thought it was someone in this thread, but I couldn't find the post. In either case at 3am this morning my home fire alarms went off for no apparent reason. So I was wide awake, trying to go back to sleep when my brain latched onto this idea.
So I started work on designing a retractable USB connector. The mechanism is not much different from what is inside a lipstick case. You have a pin that rides in a helical channel. The USB cable is fixed so it can't twist inside the black housing, but it is locked to the helical transport. (Shown in orange).
When you twist the white portion, the pin slides, and pulls the transport back into the housing. The harder challenge was actually making it so that the white and black parts mate in a way that they don't come apart when you do this twisting action. To that end I have a maze inside the black housing which you would have to do multiple twist/pull operations on the white portion before the two parts could be seperated. This seemed a better solution then some snap-fit. I am a huge proponent of serviceable products, and so I don't want any permanent connections, or things that break when you take them apart. This extends as far as using a set screw to hold the USB in place instead of say glue.
Yes, this is way overkill for the design. But like I have said earlier, once I get an idea my brain just sort of processes on it over time. Then it sort of pops back up when I realize the solution. I had the above soft-open idea written down months ago. Getting it into CAD frees up my thoughts, sort of like when you finally get rid of a song playing over and over.
(Also, it's five hours later, the house hasn't burned down yet)
Voltaire Surge
Member
I have a question regarsong the pcb and the tech the scroll wheel is attached to. You have the rod set up so that it goes through the pcb. That functions well?
Voltaire Surge: The potentiometers I am using are open in the middle, with a D shape to insert a shaft.
Most Pots have a shaft already built in. By having the shaft as a hole, I can have mechanical features on both sides of the Pot instead of just one.
They are also 360 degree pots which I will use instead of expensive digital encoders.
I will treat the scroll wheel pot sort of like a encoder I’m software. Instead of reading an absolute value, I will simply read the current value and compare it to a previous stored value.
If the current value is greater or smaller than the stored value, I know which direction the Pot is turning. With some logic to handle the 0-255 signal around the end of the pot turn.
Along with some math to control hysteresis and the mechanical detent; I should be able to get a nice solid Up/Down scrolling function.
At least that is the plan.
Most Pots have a shaft already built in. By having the shaft as a hole, I can have mechanical features on both sides of the Pot instead of just one.
They are also 360 degree pots which I will use instead of expensive digital encoders.
I will treat the scroll wheel pot sort of like a encoder I’m software. Instead of reading an absolute value, I will simply read the current value and compare it to a previous stored value.
If the current value is greater or smaller than the stored value, I know which direction the Pot is turning. With some logic to handle the 0-255 signal around the end of the pot turn.
Along with some math to control hysteresis and the mechanical detent; I should be able to get a nice solid Up/Down scrolling function.
At least that is the plan.
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Voltaire Surge
Member
Ah ok. That sounds complicated to someone who is scientifically amd mathimatically inept XD as in me. But it sounds like it makes sense. So do 360 spin endlessly? And would this system work well for the pipboy 3000a model? Do right angle versions of these exist?
The animations and internal layouts help immensely. I'm accumulating these as a sort of "instruction manual" of sorts. I'd been winnowing through all the files you put up and trying to make sense of it all.
I also finally :facepalm have the first of the dozen holotapes I need to ultimately get in my cart on Shapeways, but since you mentioned a page or so back you're switching (pun unavoidable) how the functionality of the holotapes will work, should I hold off on the chassis until you've finished a revision? I have no problem swapping the chassis out of my cart and getting a couple more cases in its place.
I have some questions and concerns, since you won't be doing kits or putting locked designs up on Shapeways... Do you recommend all the same material for 3D printing? The printer I have immediate access to runs 1.75mm filament, is optimized for PLA and PLA+, but can run ABS. I don't know if you'd recommend taking the files and running them through Shapeways in one of the sintered, powder-bed-printed methods. I figure the better the resolution and the more durable the materials, the better the final product. Related to that, the main body clamshells and the inner arm braces are all bigger than my printable area, so I was probably going to have to go through Shapeways for those, anyway. If so, should I just go ahead and do all of them through there? Or print what I can on-site and only outsource what I have to?
I'm sourcing and pricing all the off-the-rack components you've recommended, going through all 18 (19, now) pages to list and revise everything you've found (and, in some cases, discarded). Do you have a master list you've been maintaining?
About the one thing I may want to ask you to make and sell yourself would be the 3D-printed circuit board, if you already have the capacity for that. That's a piece I'd have to outsource, and the estimates I've seen are frustrating.
I also finally :facepalm have the first of the dozen holotapes I need to ultimately get in my cart on Shapeways, but since you mentioned a page or so back you're switching (pun unavoidable) how the functionality of the holotapes will work, should I hold off on the chassis until you've finished a revision? I have no problem swapping the chassis out of my cart and getting a couple more cases in its place.
I have some questions and concerns, since you won't be doing kits or putting locked designs up on Shapeways... Do you recommend all the same material for 3D printing? The printer I have immediate access to runs 1.75mm filament, is optimized for PLA and PLA+, but can run ABS. I don't know if you'd recommend taking the files and running them through Shapeways in one of the sintered, powder-bed-printed methods. I figure the better the resolution and the more durable the materials, the better the final product. Related to that, the main body clamshells and the inner arm braces are all bigger than my printable area, so I was probably going to have to go through Shapeways for those, anyway. If so, should I just go ahead and do all of them through there? Or print what I can on-site and only outsource what I have to?
I'm sourcing and pricing all the off-the-rack components you've recommended, going through all 18 (19, now) pages to list and revise everything you've found (and, in some cases, discarded). Do you have a master list you've been maintaining?
About the one thing I may want to ask you to make and sell yourself would be the 3D-printed circuit board, if you already have the capacity for that. That's a piece I'd have to outsource, and the estimates I've seen are frustrating.
iklask
New Member
A bit off topic but just wanted to say that I'm glad you got back into the project! I've been stalking this thread for a while (years? holy ****...) and its given me a lot of inspiration for modding my own pipboy. Say what you will about 76 but damn that new (old?) pipboy looks sick; the announcement got me hyped on pipboy building again!
Voltaire Surge, go ahead and PM or e-mail me for support on your Pip-Boy 3000 project, please don't keep asking the questions in this thread if they aren't related to the Pip-Boy 3000 Mk IV. But to answer your questions: Yes, they spin endlessly. No they don't come in a R/A version.
@ Inquisitor Peregrinus. The holotapes on Shapeways are the Prop version. They are only semi-functional. In that you can install a LED/Switch/Battery and resistor and make the output in the back light up. The holotapes for this project are the "fully functional version", and still a work in progress.
The "Unfinished version" for which I released the CAD files is just that. Unfinished. There are no guarentee on anything as the design wasn't complete. There are warnings to that effect in the readme file. All of the parts were designed for Selective Sintered (SLS Nylon) 3D printing. You can try and print them using other means. Some parts will work with traditional FDM 3D printing better than others. The geometry and wall thickness's all rely on that solid Nylon to be strong, and sometimes flexible. FDM Nylon can emulate this to a smaller degree, and I have found that PLA isn't terrible with the right geometry. But again, I only use my FDM machine for prototypes and mockups.
The BOM in the unfinished version isn't complete. But the list to follow is looking at the file names in the hardware and electrical. As I purged all the discarded components before releasing the unfinished version.
As far as when I finish this build... no promises on a kit or even PCBs to order. I may end up with some extra parts and I will probably kit those out to a few people as requested. But I caused too many headaches to make every part of the design order-able (Even though 99% of it is)
iklask. I love the design of the Pip-Boy 2000 Mk VI. I would be done by now if the 3000 Mk IV wasn't so complicated. It has my re-hyped about the whole project all over again. The couple of interviews and the NoClip documentaries on Fallout 76 also have me excited for the game.
@ Inquisitor Peregrinus. The holotapes on Shapeways are the Prop version. They are only semi-functional. In that you can install a LED/Switch/Battery and resistor and make the output in the back light up. The holotapes for this project are the "fully functional version", and still a work in progress.
The "Unfinished version" for which I released the CAD files is just that. Unfinished. There are no guarentee on anything as the design wasn't complete. There are warnings to that effect in the readme file. All of the parts were designed for Selective Sintered (SLS Nylon) 3D printing. You can try and print them using other means. Some parts will work with traditional FDM 3D printing better than others. The geometry and wall thickness's all rely on that solid Nylon to be strong, and sometimes flexible. FDM Nylon can emulate this to a smaller degree, and I have found that PLA isn't terrible with the right geometry. But again, I only use my FDM machine for prototypes and mockups.
The BOM in the unfinished version isn't complete. But the list to follow is looking at the file names in the hardware and electrical. As I purged all the discarded components before releasing the unfinished version.
As far as when I finish this build... no promises on a kit or even PCBs to order. I may end up with some extra parts and I will probably kit those out to a few people as requested. But I caused too many headaches to make every part of the design order-able (Even though 99% of it is)
iklask. I love the design of the Pip-Boy 2000 Mk VI. I would be done by now if the 3000 Mk IV wasn't so complicated. It has my re-hyped about the whole project all over again. The couple of interviews and the NoClip documentaries on Fallout 76 also have me excited for the game.
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seekerofgiants
Active Member
Absolutely incredible! I wish I could come up with this...
*takes notes* Okay, so...
Right. I thought the dimensions were the same, though, and thus the cases were interchangeable between prop and functional, with only the hidden parts of the chassis different between the two versions... I can't shake the notion that RFID chips in the holotapes and a reader in the floor of the carraige might be the best way to go. Small components, no moving parts... I'd keep the rotating switch to turn the LED on or off, though, so that battery didn't get run down while you had it sitting in a bag somewhere.
Still pondering science on how a real holotape would even work. Actual laser-encoded, holographic visual data on the tape? Like a 3D version of the coding on a BluRay? Or a holdover slang term, like how we use "holographic" when we mean "volumetric"? Possibilities...
I knew I'd be taking my chances with anything I printed, and plan to do at least a couple tests with PLA or PLA+ filament to get a rough sense of things before committing to any given final material. My ultimate plan is to do all the outer casing pieces through Shapeways one at a time in their SLM aluminum, and black nylon or ABS for the knobs, tape carriage, screen surround, etc. And frosted ultra detail for the lenses. Any of those add-on, internal, or finishing bits you end up doing in batches, I'd definitely be interested in a set, but I know there are no promises there.
The thought that there were more to sift through than there are makes me weep a little... Ever more I admire your mental fortitude to stare into this void.
A follow-on thought that I won't make a separate post for over in the PB2000 thread -- how oversized does that holotape look? And have you considered messaging the Wand Company and mentioning that, citing the 3000, its tape carriage size, your scaling efforts...? Maybe point them at the relevant posts in this thread...? It's not supposed to be released until December. This may be enough time that they could fix theirs. If not, at least we'd never wonder "what if we'd told them...?"
Right. I thought the dimensions were the same, though, and thus the cases were interchangeable between prop and functional, with only the hidden parts of the chassis different between the two versions... I can't shake the notion that RFID chips in the holotapes and a reader in the floor of the carraige might be the best way to go. Small components, no moving parts... I'd keep the rotating switch to turn the LED on or off, though, so that battery didn't get run down while you had it sitting in a bag somewhere.
Still pondering science on how a real holotape would even work. Actual laser-encoded, holographic visual data on the tape? Like a 3D version of the coding on a BluRay? Or a holdover slang term, like how we use "holographic" when we mean "volumetric"? Possibilities...
I knew I'd be taking my chances with anything I printed, and plan to do at least a couple tests with PLA or PLA+ filament to get a rough sense of things before committing to any given final material. My ultimate plan is to do all the outer casing pieces through Shapeways one at a time in their SLM aluminum, and black nylon or ABS for the knobs, tape carriage, screen surround, etc. And frosted ultra detail for the lenses. Any of those add-on, internal, or finishing bits you end up doing in batches, I'd definitely be interested in a set, but I know there are no promises there.
The thought that there were more to sift through than there are makes me weep a little... Ever more I admire your mental fortitude to stare into this void.
A follow-on thought that I won't make a separate post for over in the PB2000 thread -- how oversized does that holotape look? And have you considered messaging the Wand Company and mentioning that, citing the 3000, its tape carriage size, your scaling efforts...? Maybe point them at the relevant posts in this thread...? It's not supposed to be released until December. This may be enough time that they could fix theirs. If not, at least we'd never wonder "what if we'd told them...?"
@ Inquisitor Peregrinus: Sorry, yes the external dimensions and look are all fixed. And the two will be interchangeable. The new holotape actually had a tiny magnet which does two functions. When the dust cover on the holotape is closed, the holotape is off and will draw virtually no power. In the off position this magnet also is attracted to a second magnet inside, keeping the door closed.
When the dust door is opened, the holotape turns on. The holotape will consume very little power when on, if left on it would takes weeks to drain a CR2032 battery. I may still put in a tiny Arduino compatible circuit inside, just to make the whole thing programmable. With a Arduino inside I can control the optical output, and sleep settings much easier than a hard wired circuit. At first I thought that I couldn't run a Arduino of less than 3V, but I have found that you can get a ATiny85 chip that runs as low as 1.7V.
With a Arduino on-board two-way optical data is also possible. But it would be a tiny amount of data, but enough for a text Holotape storage device. All of this is stuff milling around in my head. I may end up going with my simpler IR transmitter, or RFID.
As far as how a real-holotape would work. It figure it is not much different than a CD/DVD/BluRay.. You take a winding of plastic tape, and etch it with your data as it move past. If you encode the data holographically you can in theory fit more data into the same space. Optical tape data storage does exist.
-----
Regarding the parts. An aluminum print would be very expensive, and it isn't as precise as SLS nylon. I would stick with the nylon for everything except maybe the metal parts. (Eject button, and latch).
------
My holotape is scaled to the correct aspect ratio as what you see in-game. I only scaled it to fit inside the Pip-Boy. The Want Company seems to have skewed their to fit inside their holder. They probably ran out of room inside after adding the eject mechanism. in reality the game totally cheats the holotape insertion and it passes right through the cassette holder.
When the dust door is opened, the holotape turns on. The holotape will consume very little power when on, if left on it would takes weeks to drain a CR2032 battery. I may still put in a tiny Arduino compatible circuit inside, just to make the whole thing programmable. With a Arduino inside I can control the optical output, and sleep settings much easier than a hard wired circuit. At first I thought that I couldn't run a Arduino of less than 3V, but I have found that you can get a ATiny85 chip that runs as low as 1.7V.
With a Arduino on-board two-way optical data is also possible. But it would be a tiny amount of data, but enough for a text Holotape storage device. All of this is stuff milling around in my head. I may end up going with my simpler IR transmitter, or RFID.
As far as how a real-holotape would work. It figure it is not much different than a CD/DVD/BluRay.. You take a winding of plastic tape, and etch it with your data as it move past. If you encode the data holographically you can in theory fit more data into the same space. Optical tape data storage does exist.
-----
Regarding the parts. An aluminum print would be very expensive, and it isn't as precise as SLS nylon. I would stick with the nylon for everything except maybe the metal parts. (Eject button, and latch).
------
My holotape is scaled to the correct aspect ratio as what you see in-game. I only scaled it to fit inside the Pip-Boy. The Want Company seems to have skewed their to fit inside their holder. They probably ran out of room inside after adding the eject mechanism. in reality the game totally cheats the holotape insertion and it passes right through the cassette holder.
Ohhhh...! I get it now. Nice. Will stand by to see what you do with the chassis and internals, and go ahead with the cases in batches of three.
Yep. I was pondering how much was like that or something else. I'm a fan of crystal memory, where the write angle matters, too, and multiple bits can be recorded in the same point, just read from different directions. Given the rise of multiple-viewing-angle screens, I had a vague notion of something like that potentially coming into play.
Less precise? That's disappointing. Shapeways says a lot about how accurate and clear their aluminum prints are.
Ew. Frustrating. Did you have any preliminary thoughts as to how to address the 2000's holder? Or just going to wait til December to mull it over with the kit in-hand?
