Alice in Wonderland... Change up. What was YOUR favorite scene?

[Colin Droidmilk]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I fell asleep.

Twice.

Horrid design, FX... and just so boring!

Not surprised. The awful design and sickly FX are clear from the trailer. Also clear is that the spirit of Carroll has been thrown out to make way for Jack Sparrow. And I have no time for adult Alices. The fact that Alice has a child's mind is central to the whole point of the thing. In view of all this, I'm allowed not to go and see it, yes?

 

[Egon Spengler]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I went in thinking it was going to suck but I actually really enjoyed it. They did a great job actually. There's Depp but there's way way more Alice going on than anything. I was extremely pleased by that. I don't see it as Jack Sparrow in Wonderland at all. The only thing that was a bit dumb was his dance at the end.

 

[Jeyl]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I LIKED it. I liked it a lot. Alice was a character that had development, there was a very nice reasonable story going on, the characters were interesting to watch, the atmosphere was dead on, the action was fun, the comedy was funny. I mean, what more could I ask for?

Oh, wait. There is more! This fantasy/action movie has a leading character that's female. How many times do we get that? Not many. You look back at all those big hits like Star Trek, Transformers, District 9, The Dark Knight, Pirates of the Caribbean, Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, ANY comic book movie, ANY Pixar movie ect, ya. You get the general idea.

This is my movie and I'm sticking to it with all my guns.

 

[moffeaton]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

WHen the heck is Tim Burton going to cast someone besides his wife and Depp, and when the heck is he going to direct something original? I am still mystified how the guy who brought us Beetlejuice could make Charlie and The Chocolate Factory. I still get near-angry about the fact that I spent money on that film. And I get the same sinking feeling when I see the Alice trailers. Just another Tim Burton "going through the motions" with a property he doesn't have to do anything challenging with - just poop it onto the screen and people will show up. Ehhh, I used to expect MORE from him. Now, he's just making The Cat in the Hat for Goth kids.

 

[Colin Droidmilk]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

WHen the heck is Tim Burton going to cast someone besides his wife and Depp...?

Indeed.

How was Depp cast? Did Burton begin with the creative decision that a cute, square-jawed handsome guy would be a more imaginative rendering of the character than the grotesque Hatter of tradition, and then he thought of Depp? I hope that's the way it was. It's a bad creative decision, but better than the sad alternative, which is that he just wanted Depp for the Depp schtick and failed to give proper regard to the visual requirements of Carroll's character.

EDIT: I just read a review (The Independent) which entirely confirms my very worst fear about this film, one which I refrained from expressing earlier, namely that formulaic action-adventure predictability has entirely replaced the whimsical illogicality of the original. Carroll and his best interpreters such as Svankmajer were never interested in 'good v evil' or even believable characters and story arcs. They're above all that. The whole point of 'Alice in Wonderland' is its absurdity, its escape from logic and logical motivation.

 

[nickytea]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Colin, if you insist on continuing like this, at least blame the hand that wrote it: Linda Woolverton, who created this new version long before Burton or Depp were on board. If you're REALLY interested, her first draft screenplay is readily available online for you to critique. There are only a few missing bits that were moved around for the finished film.

Quite frankly, while the "story" of Carroll's books isn't there (if you can call it a story, in any traditional sense), the entire language she developed for the film is based heavily on his nonsense poetry ... largely Jabberwocky, of course. His touch is felt here, but not just his. This movie also plays on the evolution of Alice as a force in our culture, beyond the original works, as much as the original works themselves.

They're above all that.

I wouldn't say that absence of defined narrative or motivation is the same as being "above" them. (Or even critiquing them, as some have implied over the years.) Forgive me if I sound like I'm harping, but I just happen to be a Carroll fan, who loves this new movie as well.

 

[Jodo]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I like Johnny, and I like Helena Bonham Carter, but I also get tired of seeing them together. :lol

I liked the movie, I figured there might be more to it that what there was...But it was a good movie none the less.

 

[Colin Droidmilk]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Colin, if you insist on continuing like this, at least blame the hand that wrote it: Linda Woolverton, who created this new version long before Burton or Depp were on board. If you're REALLY interested, her first draft screenplay is readily available online for you to critique. There are only a few missing bits that were moved around for the finished film.

Quite frankly, while the "story" of Carroll's books isn't there (if you can call it a story, in any traditional sense), the entire language she developed for the film is based heavily on his nonsense poetry ... largely Jabberwocky, of course. His touch is felt here, but not just his. This movie also plays on the evolution of Alice as a force in our culture, beyond the original works, as much as the original works themselves.

I wouldn't say that absence of defined narrative or motivation is the same as being "above" them. (Or even critiquing them, as some have implied over the years.) Forgive me if I sound like I'm harping, but I just happen to be a Carroll fan, who loves this new movie as well.

I blame Woolverton happily for the script decisions. But I blame Burton for Depping up the Mad Hatter.

Has Woolverton used the Jabberwock nonsense words to make a working language? If so, this is another point against the film for me. This isn't Tolkien. Let nonsense words remain nonsense words.

I was over-zealous in using the phrase 'above all that', but this comes from the despair I feel at hearing that Alice - that rare thing, a masterpiece of the absurd - has been burdened with the banality of a lot of hoary old conventional plot contrivances ( prophecies and evil queen to defeat etc.). Wonderland is more wonderful than that.

Forgive me if it seems I've been banging on...

 

[letmebestormy]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

How was the Phish 3D trailer?

 

[the_eli]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

You are right, Carroll is not Tolkien and Tolkien wasnt and will not be the only person who uses nonsense words.

The whole idea of the film was a retelling of Alice's adventure in Wonderland. Get off the fact of Burton and Depp and at least appreciate the fact that were hundreds of others that put themselves into this film.

Again, I LOVED a story from a different angle. Thats just my opinion anyway and I guess we are all entitled =)

 

[nickytea]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

has been burdened with the banality of a lot of hoary old conventional plot contrivances

One man's plot contrivance is another man's archetypal recurrence.

Never mind the fact that the nature of Carroll's prose is inherently not cinematic, and the evidence against a straight translations can be seen in all the abysmal Alice failures that sprinkle cinema's past.

 

[Remo]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Is this too dark for younger kids? I have 4 year old twins and I wasn't sure how this would be for them.

 

[SmilingOtter]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I just can't get past the fact that Depp looks like Elijah Wood! Can't wait to see it though.

I too thought it was Wood the first time I saw the poster.

Is this too dark for younger kids? I have 4 year old twins and I wasn't sure how this would be for them.

Spoiler

The little mouse does at one point pluck out one of the Bandersnatch's eyes. I wasn't really expecting that.

I liked it well enough. Won't need to see it again in the theater or own it, though.

I loved all the armor - Alice's, the White Queen's chess-piece soldiers and the Red Queen's card soldiers were all very cool.

And the Cheshire Cat really comes close to stealing the movie.

One thing I pondered: why does the Hatter suddenly and occasionally become Scottish?

 

[Laffo]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I didn't like Alice in Wonderland when American McGee designed it, and like it even less now that Tim Burton recycled McGee's character design. I've waited to say anything as there are some folks, I like here, really excited over it. They deserved to get the projects done and the Movie out before the criticism starts.

Since Lewis Carroll worked in close conjunction with John Tenniel on the original Illustrations, I think we have a pretty good idea of what the creator had in mind as to what the Alice landscape and peoples looked like. I also find that pretty concrete as to what I'll except as a set of design rules for the work.

I feel the same way about the Seuss properties as well. We know exactly what The Cat in the Hat and The Grinch look like according to Seuss. I don't need Random House or Universal to "interpret" the Author's/Illustrator's vision. Since neither Carroll or Seuss had any hand in the production of their works into film, we get left these precious bits of cinema.

Tim Burton has become incapable of doing anything other than "Re-Imaginings" that age very poorly. Nightmare Before Christmas is the last endearing / enduring thing he's done. I believe Alice will age as well as Sleepy Hollow.


In spite of the problems with "Where the Wild Things Are" the character design remains distinctively Sendak.

So far only Jan Svankmajer, Percy Stow and Cecil M. Hepworth have gotten close.

Laffo.

 

[nickytea]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Laffo, you're always a gentleman.

As a Carroll fan, and an even bigger Tenniel fan, I view this version as almost an entirely separate venture. As much as I enjoy the books as works of literature, they are distinctly that, and I have NEVER enjoyed cinematic versions that stay true to the spirit of the books. As I said before, they are necessarily and inherently prose-based tales.

That being said, when charged with the task of creating a cinema version, I can think of no better approach than that of playing on the Alice that has been handed over to our culture in the hundred plus ensuing years. It has evolved, and I like where they have taken it. New aims, certainly.

I agree on McGee. I've only a passing appreciation of what he did for narrative based gaming, but still think his grasp of Carroll is exaggerated by his supporters.

Thank you for not devolving into name-calling and flagrant characterizations.

 

[Laffo]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Twas you I referred to, and Michael Giacchino looked like he was wearing one of your UP bottlecaps on stage tonight.
Laffo.

 

[the_eli]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Is this too dark for younger kids? I have 4 year old twins and I wasn't sure how this would be for them.

Remo, it might be. Its nothing like Sleepy Hollow, but the dragon did scare a lilttle one while I was watching it.

Its really fun tho. If they have seen Disney's version, they might be able to figure out the characters.

 

[Kylash]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

saw it last night, i love Burton, but this just really felt "meh"... it didnt seem to have as much of his style as other of his films, it was boring in points, i kinda didnt care what was happening, and then it turned all Narnia at the end and really didnt feel like Wonderland at all. I dunno... Ches was about the best thing in the entire film.

 

[JD]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

Twas Better than I expected. Enoyed the whimsy of it all... thought Depp's hatter came close to going over the top, but the worst of it was his make-up - I still don't get why he needed all that frakking make up, it was distracting.

The actress playing Alice was superb. She underplayed it just enough.

The Cheshire Cat and the March Hare were darn near perfect. Anne Hathaway... not sure here; the fidgety fingers kinda worked and the dark eyebrows on porcelain skin seemed out of place.

I felt the cgi and the "Burton-look" was a tad much, but after you got into it a bit, it all seemed to fit. But, yeah... it was a little too much 'Tim Burton' - the guy has some talent, but he's got too much of his own look and it takes a way from things at times.

But overall, I liked it.

As far as kids... I could see my 5 year old nephew being a little scared at first, but then digging it. His 4 year old sister would be a little more apprehensive.

 

[nickytea]

Re: Alice in Wonderland... Saw it, Loved it, Gotta see it again

I love that we have two subsequent posts in which one argues "too Butron" and the other "not Burton enough."

the fidgety fingers kinda worked and the dark eyebrows on porcelain skin seemed out of place.

This is interesting, as my wife said the same thing about the fingers. Funilly enough, the first two viewings I never noticed it. The next time, I noticed, but it didn't bother me.

As for the eyebrows, it can certainly be arresting, but when considering the character, I find it spot on. She's the sister of the Red Queen, always stressing her "vows." The dark eyebrows and subtle hint of dark roots, along with her "put on" princessness really cement the fact that she trying very, very hard to be good. It's a perfect thematic counterpart for Alice's transformation, in the sense that it is based around the idea that she must choose greatness.