Any idea what Jack is holding in the Shining photo from the end of the movie?
- Thread starter patsmear
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Kris
Sr Member
http://www.hooverae.com/upload/files/260809/3907268.jpeg Here is a pic I made of the screen used some years ago 
Just remembered that I had this one
Just remembered that I had this one 
allosaur176
Sr Member
well according to this site, that was posted on the old thread anyways
http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/faq/html/shining/shining.html
chewbaccadoll
Sr Member
So, I've been sitting here trying to position my hand the way Jack is in the pic, and although I know everyone is shaped different and are not the same when it comes to finger length, hand width, etc. I have to say that I can't make that pose comfortably, having my thumb pressed against my hand.
My theory is that his thumb is in front of his hand and not pressed against it tightly. It's not a natural pose and my hand is at least similar to Jacks in proportion.
At first glance it appeared to be a Band -Aid and I still believe it to be. I don't think it was premeditated either, just something that was there that wasn't thought of.
My theory is that his thumb is in front of his hand and not pressed against it tightly. It's not a natural pose and my hand is at least similar to Jacks in proportion.
At first glance it appeared to be a Band -Aid and I still believe it to be. I don't think it was premeditated either, just something that was there that wasn't thought of.
weaselflinger
Sr Member
Could it be a piece of confetti?
I am not quite so sure about this. Please consider the following:
If someone said, "ok, say cheese," I might be inclined to remove a cigarette from my mouth a)not to be rude, b)to offer the most flattering pose of myself and c)to make the gesture I might choose to make (let's say opening my arms wide in celebrating the moment as the gentleman did in the original photo).
To take it further, my dad has smoked since I was a child and I know from his habits the following:
Generally, there are a few ways to remove a cigarette from your mouth to expell smoke OR to preserve the cigarette mid smoke. If my father is mid smoke and is in a place that allows open smoking, he puts it in between his index and second finger, and arches his hand away from his body at the elbow and holds the cigarette at his side in this position. (To discard it, he would toss it to the ground, stomp it out and pick up the filter).
If he is smoking is a situation that calls for more discretion (in front of family members who oppose smoking, etc.) He will instead turn his body a bit and when he is finished, will clip it at the filter in between fleshy part of his thumb and index finger, careful to clip it in such a way not to burn his fingers. I argue, it is this second method that was utilized by the man in the photo.
I do not believe the cigarette was lit. My theory is that the man rolled one up and was about to smoke when the photo was announced. He clipped it in his hand to essentially hide it (not that he felt it was that important, but seems like a natural gesture).
On that point, I am often holding souvenir bags in photos taken while I am on vacation. I have noticed that if someone else is in the photo with me, I will always place the hand with the bag behind the other person to hide the bag from the photo. It is not conscious, but I always do it.
Now, consider this evidence. Because I am a dork..cough, I mean law student, and a common technique at trials is reenactment, I took the liberty of rolling a fake (I detest the idea of smoking) old style cigarette using a random piece of paper. I put in between my lips. When I clipped it in between the fleshy part of my thumb and index finger and pulled it from my body to open my arms, this is what I saw when I looked down:
Case closed? Try it yourself and let me know.
Joe
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I'd agree with the unrolled cigarette paper theory. In the 1920s smoking was rampant and a large number of people would roll their own cigarettes to save money (they smoked that much). For example, in Australia between the 1920s and mid 30s, the percentage of smokers using roll your own cigarettes went from 42 to 66%.
So did Jack have a ring on his fourth right finger in the film? :lol
I think you can tell in the brightened image that they put not just his face but his upper shoulder area as well....the costuming is different than the other gentleman in the photo.
So did Jack have a ring on his fourth right finger in the film? :lol
I think you can tell in the brightened image that they put not just his face but his upper shoulder area as well....the costuming is different than the other gentleman in the photo.
I am not quite so sure about this. Please consider the following:
If someone said, "ok, say cheese," I might be inclined to remove a cigarette from my mouth a)not to be rude, b)to offer the most flattering pose of myself and c)to make the gesture I might choose to make (let's say opening my arms wide in celebrating the moment as the gentleman did in the original photo).
To take it further, my dad has smoked since I was a child and I know from his habits the following:
Generally, there are a few ways to remove a cigarette from your mouth to expell smoke OR to preserve the cigarette mid smoke. If my father is mid smoke and is in a place that allows open smoking, he puts it in between his index and second finger, and arches his hand away from his body at the elbow and holds the cigarette at his side in this position. (To discard it, he would toss it to the ground, stomp it out and pick up the filter).
If he is smoking is a situation that calls for more discretion (in front of family members who oppose smoking, etc.) He will instead turn his body a bit and when he is finished, will clip it at the filter in between fleshy part of his thumb and index finger, careful to clip it in such a way not to burn his fingers. I argue, it is this second method that was utilized by the man in the photo.
I do not believe the cigarette was lit. My theory is that the man rolled one up and was about to smoke when the photo was announced. He clipped it in his hand to essentially hide it (not that he felt it was that important, but seems like a natural gesture).
On that point, I am often holding souvenir bags in photos taken while I am on vacation. I have noticed that if someone else is in the photo with me, I will always place the hand with the bag behind the other person to hide the bag from the photo. It is not conscious, but I always do it.
Now, consider this evidence. Because I am a dork..cough, I mean law student, and a common technique at trials is reenactment, I took the liberty of rolling a fake (I detest the idea of smoking) old style cigarette using a random piece of paper. I put in between my lips. When I clipped it in between the fleshy part of my thumb and index finger and pulled it from my body to open my arms, this is what I saw when I looked down:
Case closed? Try it yourself and let me know.
Joe
Here's some more evidence for the disbelievers. This picture was taken in the 1920's of two women smoking rolled cigarettes. Look familiar?
One more for good measure:
chewbaccadoll
Sr Member
Well, Joe you certainly do your homework! Case Closed is a bit much, though. I can appreciate your experiment and agree with some of what you said, but being a past smoker I know a little about the habit and I have to say that I still feel this to be an awkward and unatural way to grasp a cig, even a self-rolled one.
I WOULD however, entertain the thought that it was a folded up, UNFILLED rolling paper. To me, it simply is too flat to be a "made" cigarette. I realize you squish them as you smoke sometimes, but that pic is of something flat. Not much dimension.
If it was a rolled cig, not lit, it would be round or at least rounder and much longer for that matter. If he was smoking it it would be burning on the end and would be visable...
I definitely am not sold on the Band-Aid as much, but a filled cig, no.
I WOULD however, entertain the thought that it was a folded up, UNFILLED rolling paper. To me, it simply is too flat to be a "made" cigarette. I realize you squish them as you smoke sometimes, but that pic is of something flat. Not much dimension.
If it was a rolled cig, not lit, it would be round or at least rounder and much longer for that matter. If he was smoking it it would be burning on the end and would be visable...
I definitely am not sold on the Band-Aid as much, but a filled cig, no.
chewbaccadoll
Sr Member
Could it possibly be something long he's holding between his index and middle fingers? Like one of those old fashioned cigarette holders? The other end going off into the blackness? The visible part looks kinda like one of those filters.
I agree we are far away from a case closed scenario unless any of us were in the photo next to Jack! I meant it more in a cheezy "you decide!" type of way.
I think your points are very valid, although I did want to mention that the "cigarette" in my hand in the pic, although rolled, was round and only appeared squished due to the angle. Granted, it was not stuffed with anything, but it was not paper flat either.
Arguably, we will never know, but it has been fun to speculate. I always love a challenge!
Also, considering we see flesh on either side of the item, I would vote "no" on it being a holder, but of course, who knows?!
I think your points are very valid, although I did want to mention that the "cigarette" in my hand in the pic, although rolled, was round and only appeared squished due to the angle. Granted, it was not stuffed with anything, but it was not paper flat either.
Arguably, we will never know, but it has been fun to speculate. I always love a challenge!
Also, considering we see flesh on either side of the item, I would vote "no" on it being a holder, but of course, who knows?!
chewbaccadoll
Sr Member
I do suppose the angle is a bit off, just a thought...
And you are correct, none of us were there, but I agree it is fun to speculate. Thanks for challenging my mind!
And you are correct, none of us were there, but I agree it is fun to speculate. Thanks for challenging my mind!
Ditto!
Jedi Lawja
Well-Known Member
Perhaps it's a lottery ticket (such parties often had 'door prizes' and whatnot), or a claim check for some article?
Jay
Jay
defstartrooper
Sr Member
As a smoker of over 20 years i can comfortably say i've never ever had occasion to hold a cigarette or a cigarette paper that way or even ever considered holding a cigarette or paper that way, and i can't say i've ever seen anyone else hold either one like that, including my Dad who's 80 and still rolls his own.
You might not have been referring to my argument, but to clarify, I wasn't saying people hold a cigarette like that, but instead that his hand is mid gesture AFTER holding it the less common way. If you have a propensity to hold it between your thumb and index finger (and not the most common way of holding it pinched between your index and second fingers), when you open up and extend your hand for the gesture he makes in the picture, it might look like Jack does.
I KNOW some people smoke like Bogart, the pro, who never used his index and second finger, but his thumb and index finger instead. I have also seen people smoke like this, but clip it a little lower between the fleshy part of the index finger and the thumb. If he removed the cigarette after holding it in the latter method, and then opened his hand to gesture, I would bet it would look a lot like the pics.
You really have to try it to understand. Not condoning smoking! pick up a golf pencil instead. One of the other reasons I am adamant is that I perform magic as a hobby and have read books covering Slydini's cigarette effect which demonstates a multitude of ways to hold cigarettes to conceal them.
I KNOW some people smoke like Bogart, the pro, who never used his index and second finger, but his thumb and index finger instead. I have also seen people smoke like this, but clip it a little lower between the fleshy part of the index finger and the thumb. If he removed the cigarette after holding it in the latter method, and then opened his hand to gesture, I would bet it would look a lot like the pics.
You really have to try it to understand. Not condoning smoking! pick up a golf pencil instead. One of the other reasons I am adamant is that I perform magic as a hobby and have read books covering Slydini's cigarette effect which demonstates a multitude of ways to hold cigarettes to conceal them.
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