Original Golden Idol from Raiders here...

[belloq]

Wow, just heard about this thread. I'm a real idol nut and this one thread and the stimulus from Propstore's photos has uncovered and confirmed more information than 10 years of digging and guessing. Thanks to all. As I've mentioned before, I'm really hoping any licensees use the hero "real eyes" idol as the direct basis for replicas (3D scan, molding, whatever.)

Don, thank you for your clarifications especially about VM. I agree about the quality of the VM I've seen, which leaves silver in the deeper crevices of an intended gold sculpture. I've never understood this, because my understanding is that all VM comes out of the chamber silver (aluminum coating) and the color- gold, red, green, whatever- is a tint added to the protective clear lacquer as the final finishing step. Therefore, if there is any silver left in the crevices on an intended gold piece, it is because the vendor did not sufficiently spray the colored lacquer in those crevices.

Don, can you recommend a vendor who does this properly?

 

[confusion]

Man, this is what I LOVE about the RPF, cool info like this thread! Keep the info coming fellas!

 

[IndyBlues]

This is a fantastic discussion. Man, how did I miss this thread??
'Blues

 

[artoo77]

Yes--the chrome is typically aluminum, and the color is provided by a clear lacquer.

I got this link off of this forum, I believe:
http://mmmetalizing.com/index.html

Never used them, but would be interested in how they do.

I created the Lucasfilm Fan Film Awards years ago, and for reasons beyond my control I couldn't finish the first year's run. Adam Savage took over and then gave it back to me the next year (I think), and I promptly handed them over to Jon Berg (of AT-AT fame, among many others). He used the same bozos I did for a couple of years until throwing his hands up in disgust...now he uses a mutual friend in Orlando who plates them with a very complicated and expensive paint process. I know very little about it (not even the name), but it looks great. I believe Chris Bartlett, the premiere C-3P0 around here, is using it for a suit. I'll try and get some info and post it--others here might be aware of it already.

Another thread showed off a great process for the gold just recently. I have a casting that I gold-leafed; while not like the film version, I think it looks great in person.

--Don Bies

Wow, just heard about this thread. I'm a real idol nut and this one thread and the stimulus from Propstore's photos has uncovered and confirmed more information than 10 years of digging and guessing. Thanks to all. As I've mentioned before, I'm really hoping any licensees use the hero "real eyes" idol as the direct basis for replicas (3D scan, molding, whatever.)

Don, thank you for your clarifications especially about VM. I agree about the quality of the VM I've seen, which leaves silver in the deeper crevices of an intended gold sculpture. I've never understood this, because my understanding is that all VM comes out of the chamber silver (aluminum coating) and the color- gold, red, green, whatever- is a tint added to the protective clear lacquer as the final finishing step. Therefore, if there is any silver left in the crevices on an intended gold piece, it is because the vendor did not sufficiently spray the colored lacquer in those crevices.

Don, can you recommend a vendor who does this properly?

 

[SFPROPS]

I got this link off of this forum, I believe:
http://mmmetalizing.com/index.html

I posted that, but I can't vouch for their quality. They are reasonably priced though.

Here are 2 other sources I'd found previously:

http://www.chrometechusa.com/
http://www.atlaschrome.com/plastic.html

As far as the expensive spray technique (which I've heard if done right gives awesome results), I think this is what Don is talking about:

http://www.fantachrome.com.au/index2.html

Alsa sells a rattle can kit which is supposed to give good results if you follow the directions. It's pricey for rattle cans, but results are as good or better than something like Alclad II which does a good job for regular chromes. I don't think they offer golds.

 

[artoo77]

Let's not call them ILM versions...no proof it was made there.

I'm not sure why there are two sculpts...I didn't even notice it until you guys pointed it out, but here it is. All I could tell you is that both of those castings were there when I first saw them in 1987.

As to the history of molds: I understand Lorne Peterson made a mold of the Idol at one point before my involvement there (pre 1987). That silicone mold kicked around the model shop for awhile, and when we were doing Ghostbusters 2, it seemed everyone was taking castings. Several of the crew on that show were up from LA, and then took their idols back with them...where they showed two friends, and they showed two friends and so on, and so on, and so on...years later, when some of the guys from Icons came to the archives, they brought one of their castings and were shocked to see how much smaller it was when put next to the Idol with eyes.

The Peterson mold fell apart, and I took the last casting out of it in plaster, cleaned it up and remolded it...and that's the casting I have (and I believe the one in the archive book).

Yes, silicone contamination is a problem, but apparently can be remedied through sealing it with certain types of primer barriers. This idol was years old and not freshly pulled from a mold; I think the pockmarking came from either the handling and restoration materials (lacquer primer, bondo, etc) or the idiots that did the VM. It appears to happen only in the lacquer stage, but I could be wrong.

--Don

So I'm curious...

Do/did ALL the ILM real eyes versions have the oval mouth, and do/did all the ILM gold eye versions have the turned down mouth?

And WHY are there two different sculpts in the LFL archives? Was one version produced in England and one in the US?

Both these idols (at least inthe coloring of this image on my monitor) are fringing on the orange look of "gold chrome" vac-metalizing. Also the real eyes version has significant pock marks on the forehead. Was talking with a friend who knows more than I just today... My friend stated that any silicon molded piece can (and most likely will) retain silicon contamination that does not come off with mold release or other clensers, and will screw up the vac-metalized surface.

I have a vac-metalized T2 T-800 head, and that is exactly what it looks like, pock marks et al.

 

[PHArchivist]

Let's not call them ILM versions...no proof it was made there.

Heeded - LFL would be more appropriate.

As to the history of molds: I understand Lorne Peterson made a mold of the Idol at one point before my involvement there (pre 1987). That silicone mold kicked around the model shop for awhile, and when we were doing Ghostbusters 2, it seemed everyone was taking castings. Several of the crew on that show were up from LA, and then took their idols back with them...where they showed two friends, and they showed two friends and so on, and so on, and so on...years later, when some of the guys from Icons came to the archives, they brought one of their castings and were shocked to see how much smaller it was when put next to the Idol with eyes.

The Peterson mold fell apart, and I took the last casting out of it in plaster, cleaned it up and remolded it...and that's the casting I have (and I believe the one in the archive book).

As always, a fascinating read.

Makes me wonder if one of these "he shared with two frineds, and they shared with two friends" versions is how the idol pops up in The Majestic with Jim Carey.

I'm also very curious how much smaller all these more easily accessible idol casts are than the original; Gobler's included.

 

[PHArchivist]

Another thread showed off a great process for the gold just recently. I have a casting that I gold-leafed; while not like the film version, I think it looks great in person.

--Don Bies

Might this be the one?

Better not be because that is quite a compliment coming from an industry prifessional, and I'm not sure Gig's head can handle it!

 

[Jedifyfe]

I don't think Goblers is that much smaller than the original as he had his cast from a first or second Gen idol.

 

[artoo77]

I'm sure Frank Darabont would have gotten a casting from someone in LA--he's a big fan. We had a great talk about Indy and the future Young Indy series when he visited the archives while working on Young Indy. He also sent me a copy of his script for Kenneth Brannaugh's Frankenstein--not the version filmed. As a return gift, I sent him a casting I made of the Headpiece of the Staff of Ra...

Heeded - LFL would be more appropriate.

Makes me wonder if one of these "he shared with two frineds, and they shared with two friends" versions is how the idol pops up in The Majestic with Jim Carey.

Might this be the one?
Better not be because that is quite a compliment coming from an industry prifessional, and I'm not sure Gig's head can handle it!

Yes, that's it.

If it helps prevent an inflated ego, then tell him I think it sucks.

--Don

 

[PHArchivist]

Yes, that's it.

If it helps prevent an inflated ego, then tell him I think it sucks.

--Don

I would but I try not to lie...! Fred did an awesome job on that!

 

[Megatron]

Yes, silicone contamination is a problem, but apparently can be remedied through sealing it with certain types of primer barriers. This idol was years old and not freshly pulled from a mold; I think the pockmarking came from either the handling and restoration materials (lacquer primer, bondo, etc) or the idiots that did the VM. It appears to happen only in the lacquer stage, but I could be wrong.

--Don

out gasing of some resins (bondo) can cause pockmarks.. send it happen on rush jobs I had to do when at WDW studios. Some can out gas for more then a week.

 

[PHArchivist]

Don I don't suppose you have insight or commentary on the appearance of a second contour line ("W" or "U" shaped) leading from the chin, and on up to the cheek bones? Was this a physical element of the sculpt, or an illusion of light and reflection?

Also on the eyes... Any idea if the eyes in the very clear shot of the LFL archived version are originals? They seem more like doll or teddy bear eyes than hyper-real prosthetic eyes. Any idea on a supplier!? :love

 

[PHArchivist]

These eyes - original or replacements during the resto...?

Posted with permission is a better picture of the two archive idols seen earlier in the thread.

Enjoy!

 

[Howard]

This is the one I want.

 

[WebChief]

Could anyone (especially Don) talk to the back story to these props displayed in the main house on the Ranch? I took this pic of my buddy when we were there back in 2006. I know it's not the best shot but it's all I've got.

 

[paulcarson]

Don I don't suppose you have insight or commentary on the appearance of a second contour line ("W" or "U" shaped) leading from the chin, and on up to the cheek bones? Was this a physical element of the sculpt, or an illusion of light and reflection?

Also on the eyes... Any idea if the eyes in the very clear shot of the LFL archived version are originals? They seem more like doll or teddy bear eyes than hyper-real prosthetic eyes. Any idea on a supplier!? :love

To me it looks like it could be a reflection where it hits the cheeks. The eyes seem to have more of a depth to them in the movie still than the set in the updated pictures of the idol. In my opinion they were swapped out when the idol was cleaned up and re-chromed. Don should be our man for this answer ?

 

[paulcarson]

Nice pic btw WebChief !

 

[agent5]

Whats funny is that both the idol and headpiece in both pics are different versions of the ones in the case. That headpiece in the case is the one we all see on Evilbay all the time but the one in the pic is a totally different version based on the same basic design.

 

[paulcarson]

Found this pic, could that be the idol used in the movie prior to restoration ?

http://roguedesigner.home.comcast.net/~roguedesigner/images/lflarchives/archive26_lg.jpg